steven@reev.com

How old is the setup?

what products are you using?

what are all your parameter reading?

Are you using a calcium or kalkwasser reactor? For a tank that size, I would.

A calcium reactor set up usually runs about $500 to $600, but it lasts a long time -- years in fact. All you buy after that is media, Co2 refills, and the occasional pH probe. http://www.melevsreef.com/calcium_reactor.html

To measure Calcium, i use Salifert. The color shift is easy to note.
To measure Alkalinity, I use Tropic Marin. Same as above, and the dKH reading is simply the amount of drops you counted. 8 drops, dKH is 8.

+1 on the calc reactor. Set it up with a ph controller as melev does in his article and you don't have to worry about it again aside from occasionally re-calibrating the probe. I also use Salifert test kits for my calc, alk, and mag. If you are really having problems keeping your alk up definitely test your magnesium. If it's low you will be fitting with it no matter what you do.

Originally Posted by Deep Blue

How old is the setup?

what products are you using?

what are all your parameter reading?

i had a 90 gallon setup for a year and a half then that went into the new 240 gallon, I added 200 lbs of live sand and quite a bit more live rock. the tank has a custom sump that hold 88 gallons while in normal running mode. it does have the capacity to hold a lot more water from the tank.
additive products I have been using are:
Seachem Reef builder for carb onate alkalinity
Seachem Reef advantage calium.

the alkalinity seems to drop to 6-7 dkh in a weeks time.
the calcium is at 380 to 400 usually.

Originally Posted by melev

Are you using a calcium or kalkwasser reactor? For a tank that size, I would.

A calcium reactor set up usually runs about $500 to $600, but it lasts a long time -- years in fact. All you buy after that is media, Co2 refills, and the occasional pH probe. http://www.melevsreef.com/calcium_reactor.html

To measure Calcium, i use Salifert. The color shift is easy to note.
To measure Alkalinity, I use Tropic Marin. Same as above, and the dKH reading is simply the amount of drops you counted. 8 drops, dKH is 8.

Marc, so sorry to hear about your tank. I have been following your setup for a long time. it is what inspired my setup which is a built in the wall system similar to yours.
i have not got a calcium reactor as of yet. it is in the plan. I have heard horror stories on Kalkwasser so that has me scared off a bit. will the calcium ractor help with the alkalinity? are there systems that help with that? on another note I am not confident on my salinity readings. how can I verify that my salinity readings are accurate? i bought a refractometer from marine depot that is easy to use but if I take readings at different times of the day they are different sometimes significantly. I have tried to calibrate it and it seems to be right on. with my smaller tank I did not notice such salinity swings.

-Steven

Originally Posted by yiyi67

+1 on the calc reactor. Set it up with a ph controller as melev does in his article and you don't have to worry about it again aside from occasionally re-calibrating the probe. I also use Salifert test kits for my calc, alk, and mag. If you are really having problems keeping your alk up definitely test your magnesium. If it's low you will be fitting with it no matter what you do.

my magnesium is at aboutt 1200 so that should be good.

Steven, your magnesium is too low. It should be 3x the calcium level. If your Calcium is 450ppm, Mg should be 1350ppm. I would recommend keeping Mg between 1300 and 1400ppm as a general rule. FYI, it will take a ton of Mg to bring it up from 1200 - don't be shocked, just use the reef calculator to get the math figured out and divide up that dose over 2 or 3 days. http://reef.diesyst.com/flashcalc/flashcalc.html

A calcium reactor is actually an alkalinity reactor. It will maintain both numbers in a balanced way. Read my article. If that isn't enough for you, read the massive article I linked at the base of that page.

Alternately, with separate dosing pumps and timers, you can dose two-part additives you mix up a on weekly or monthly basis. Mathematically it is a little cheaper, but the hassle factor turns me off. I'd rather have the equipment in my sump and call it a day.

You should calibrate your refractometer with 35ppt Calibration Solution. Marine Depot sells a small bottle. RO/DI water isn't the right stuff to use, although most people feel that setting their gizmo to 0 with RO will suffice. It actually isn't nearly as accurate with that method, and thus not recommended.

Originally Posted by melev

Steven, your magnesium is too low. It should be 3x the calcium level. If your Calcium is 450ppm, Mg should be 1350ppm. I would recommend keeping Mg between 1300 and 1400ppm as a general rule. FYI, it will take a ton of Mg to bring it up from 1200 - don't be shocked, just use the reef calculator to get the math figured out and divide up that dose over 2 or 3 days. http://reef.diesyst.com/flashcalc/flashcalc.html

A calcium reactor is actually an alkalinity reactor. It will maintain both numbers in a balanced way. Read my article. If that isn't enough for you, read the massive article I linked at the base of that page.

Alternately, with separate dosing pumps and timers, you can dose two-part additives you mix up a on weekly or monthly basis. Mathematically it is a little cheaper, but the hassle factor turns me off. I'd rather have the equipment in my sump and call it a day.

You should calibrate your refractometer with 35ppt Calibration Solution. Marine Depot sells a small bottle. RO/DI water isn't the right stuff to use, although most people feel that setting their gizmo to 0 with RO will suffice. It actually isn't nearly as accurate with that method, and thus not recommended.

Oh wow I did not know about the Mg I just went by what the test instructions said. any recommendation on what to adjust it with? after my post I did go read your articles in completion. great resource thanks. and I will definitely get some Calibration Solution. I have been using the RO/DI water to Calibrate.
Thanks for all the help.

You can mix up your own Magnesium. I use 7.25 cups of Magnesium chloride (Driveway Heat) and .75 of a cup of Magnesium sulfide (Epsons Salt), mixed with exaclty 1 gallon of RO/DI water. This is Recipe #2 by Randy Holmes Farley. Once mixed, the calculator will indicate you need to add. For example: 1400 ml of this solution, which is nearly three-quarters of a 2-liter (2000 ml) bottle.

You can purchase Mg at your LFS by the jug (half-gallon usually).

my LFS did not have the Driveway Heat and I would have needed to get about 6 jars of the small powder they had so for the time being I got Magnesion by Brightwell Aquatics. it is a concentrated Magnesium supplement. do you see any problem with me using this to get things back on track? it says I can use the maximum rate of 10ml per 20 gallons per day to bring it up to the right level. this means I would have to add 144ml per day for about 7.5 days to raise it 200 ppm this will raise to 1400 ppm.

ok so I checked my mg and it is now down to 1050 what the hey! added 145ml of additive today and will continue each day till it is back on track, should take about 7 or 8 days. but why is it dropping?

-SR

What kind of salt are you using and have you tested your mixed water at all? If you have been doing water changes with mag deficient salt you are working against yourself there too.

As far as the driveway heat, I believe this can be picked up at lowes or home depot, I don't think it is necessarily something your LFS would keep handy.

When you are dosing your mag, make sure you dose it in small quantities throughout the day. If you just dump it all in you run the risk of harming your livestock and possibly causing it to precipitate and therefore be useless.

Originally Posted by yiyi67

What kind of salt are you using and have you tested your mixed water at all? If you have been doing water changes with mag deficient salt you are working against yourself there too.

As far as the driveway heat, I believe this can be picked up at lowes or home depot, I don't think it is necessarily something your LFS would keep handy.

When you are dosing your mag, make sure you dose it in small quantities throughout the day. If you just dump it all in you run the risk of harming your livestock and possibly causing it to precipitate and therefore be useless.

I decided to test my salt which is Seachem Reef Salt. it was only about 850. I just mixed up a few gallons to the 1.026 salinity level then tested it. with my Mag test kit which is. Red Sea Magnesium test kit.
What are your thoughts on this salt and test kit? I would have never thought the salt mix would not have everything in it should. The mg additive said to add 10mg per 20 gallons as a maximum per day, I have been adding it to some fresh RO/DI water. should I add half in the morning and the other half at night?

Ok so it does look like the magnesium may be precipitating. I have some whitish particles floating around in the water. I have to go to work each day so how do I get my magnesium up to where it needs to be ? also if my calcium and alkalinity and magnesium are all a bit low. is there an order that I should be getting them up in?

I don't have a whole lot of experience with seachem reef salt, but I do know that the salt I use (Tropic Marin Pro Reef) has better numbers than that. I do have to deal with low alk from time to time but its all good as long as you are testing for it.

As far as your test kits go, I only trust the higher end kits, ie salifert and elos. You pay a premium for these but as with anything else in this hobby it seems like you get what you pay for.

As far as your dosing regiment goes, I would be putting little bits in at a time spaced out as much as you can. So if you have time to put a 1/4 of your total daily dose in before work do that. Then do another 1/4 or whatever when you get home. Then come back in another hour or so and do some more, and so on. At minimum I would space these out by at least 20- 30 minutes apart. Also make sure you are adding to a high flow area, preferably in your sump so that the additive has a chance to mix a bit with your tank water before it gets into the DT.

Originally Posted by yiyi67

I don't have a whole lot of experience with seachem reef salt, but I do know that the salt I use (Tropic Marin Pro Reef) has better numbers than that. I do have to deal with low alk from time to time but its all good as long as you are testing for it.

As far as your test kits go, I only trust the higher end kits, ie salifert and elos. You pay a premium for these but as with anything else in this hobby it seems like you get what you pay for.

As far as your dosing regiment goes, I would be putting little bits in at a time spaced out as much as you can. So if you have time to put a 1/4 of your total daily dose in before work do that. Then do another 1/4 or whatever when you get home. Then come back in another hour or so and do some more, and so on. At minimum I would space these out by at least 20- 30 minutes apart. Also make sure you are adding to a high flow area, preferably in your sump so that the additive has a chance to mix a bit with your tank water before it gets into the DT.

This morning I switched to adding half before work and half this evening. and Yes I always put all additives in the sump.

Does anyone have a recommendation on what is the best Reef Salt product?

Originally Posted by yiyi67

I don't have a whole lot of experience with seachem reef salt, but I do know that the salt I use (Tropic Marin Pro Reef) has better numbers than that. I do have to deal with low alk from time to time but its all good as long as you are testing for it.

As far as your test kits go, I only trust the higher end kits, ie salifert and elos. You pay a premium for these but as with anything else in this hobby it seems like you get what you pay for.

As far as your dosing regiment goes, I would be putting little bits in at a time spaced out as much as you can. So if you have time to put a 1/4 of your total daily dose in before work do that. Then do another 1/4 or whatever when you get home. Then come back in another hour or so and do some more, and so on. At minimum I would space these out by at least 20- 30 minutes apart. Also make sure you are adding to a high flow area, preferably in your sump so that the additive has a chance to mix a bit with your tank water before it gets into the DT.

So after several days of adding the maximum Magnesium additive of 10ml per 20 gallons which is 145ml per day. I am not seeing the mg increase.
What gives?